Meet the 7.62 Yahweh

[Castle]

Ok, I didn't give it the name. It suppose to be some greatly improved 7.62x39 cartridge that operates around 52Kpsi. I hadn't heard of it until it was presented on another forum but the thread got shut down by the administrator because it turned into comedy central.

Here's the site:
https://www.762yahweh.com/

And there's a video on YouTube also,
https://m.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=4Dz5kzuItH0


It's from the MIRACLE CARTRIDGE COMPANY LLC.

Not kidding, the inventor claims about a 500 fps increase over standard 7.62×39. Or roughly 2600 to 2650 with a 150 grain bullet and that his new design was divinely inspired.

So... where to begin? Where's Zee?

[CPJ 2.0]

More like the 7.62 Yurgay.
I skipped through the video.
Too much showmanship and wankery.
GIVE ME THE GOD DAMNED DETAILS.
Show me in print, the data. Show me in print, the cartridge drawing. Don’t show me a steel plate shot with two different rounds with two different bullets and expect me to be impressed.
Because I’m not.

[Castle]

That's pretty much the response it got on another forum and then it went downhill from there. It was pretty hilarious.

[mitdr774]

Best I can come up with is that they took a standard 7.62x39 case, used a sizing die to give it a double shoulder angle, and then loaded it to a higher pressure. I could be mistaken in that though. They have not exactly offered up a whole lot of information on this new and amazing cartridge that is probably mostly snake oil.

[Bigslug]

The "God damned details" are covered in a couple of the replies to comments:

"The case has a 17-30 degree angle and a 30 degree angle on the case so it headspaces both cases Ackley just squeezed it in the chamber and let go. We are getting 2600-2650 fps out of it 150 grain bullet in a 20” barrel and 2500-2550 out a16” barrel and 2875 with a 125 grain and a 20” barrel. I hope this is helpful. RG"

"The parent cartridge case is the 6mm PPC with the taper of the 223 and yes it is blown out but it has about .035 thousands of an inch on the first angle coming off the neck of the case and then it transitions to a 30 degree shoulder angle so it has 2 different shoulder angles with the first one matching the 7.62x39 cartridge and the second one being 30 degrees to help hold the powder in the case while it is burning making it very efficient. You can use the fire formed 7.62x39 brass but you have to download it by 2 grains because the 7.62x39 case has less capacity than the 6mm PPC case. The other part of the equation is our special gas tube that gives it the dwell that it needs. I’m also developing a subsonic round for it also I just need a little more time to fine tune the load data but I have gotten it to function semiautomatic with it locking back on an empty magazine."

So after Bubba gets the cases all blown out, and finishes screwing around with alternating his wildcat with standard 7.62x39 in the half-assed AK-curve-yet-fits-in-an-AR magazine, will he actually be able to fit more than a dozen rounds of the wildcat in? What magazines will it be using? Somewhat intriguing, I suppose, once it gets a little farther down the prototype road - - at least for the "any given cartridge is useless until you fit it into an AR-15" camp.

[Zee]

He lost me at the dramatic example of being pushed back onto one leg and loosing his balance under recoil.
Signed off.

Don't piss down my back and tell me it’s raining.

[Chiro1989]

You do have a lower center of gravity, recoil affects you less

[GrapeApe]

+500 fps with the same bullet and parent case... NOPE, not without THROUGH THE ROOF pressures. Velocity is based on the time under pressure and the total pressure. The whole "There's no free lunch" principle.

And the curly Q gas tube, how cute.

My understanding on ARs is, that it isn't the length of the gas tube, per se. It's the location of the gas port in relation to the chamber. Closer to the chamber = a more finicky location and further down barrel = one that is normally more forgiving

[Elk Creek]

“Oh it feeds perfectly too” as the rifle doesn’t feed and hammers the forward assist to seat the round.

[Castle]

He was asked about the cartridge drawing and said it's being drawn up, so no drawing at the time of request. He was asked how he came up with the reamed chambers or the special reamer and no response. A friend came to his defense and began singing the praises of his new cartridge but when asked just to take a cellphone photo of the cartridge and post it -- no response.

I guess you can see why there's a lot of skepticism.

[Castle]

He lost me at the dramatic example of being pushed back onto one leg and loosing his balance under recoil.
Signed off.

Don't piss down my back and tell me it’s raining.

I'll tell him to aim for the ear.

[Castle]

+500 fps with the same bullet and parent case... NOPE, not without THROUGH THE ROOF pressures. Velocity is based on the time under pressure and the total pressure. The whole "There's no free lunch" principle.

And the curly Q gas tube, how cute.

My understanding on ARs is, that it isn't the length of the gas tube, per se. It's the location of the gas port in relation to the chamber. Closer to the chamber = a more finicky location and further down barrel = one that is normally more forgiving

He claims to be achieving these near 308 NATO velocities with regular powders.


According to the inventor the pressure numbers are from a man using a strain guage. At another special lab (I forget the name), using piezoelectric measurements the pressures where closer to but not exceeding 52,000 psi.

Even if what he says is true, it seems a bit disingenuous to post the lower strain guage numbers instead of the piezoelectric ones.

[Castle]

Lastly, he claimed that the double shoulder design allows for 5 - 8 more grains of powder. Without a drawing, a picture or much in the way of anything else, we can only guess whether or not that's true.

[CPJ 2.0]

He was asked about the cartridge drawing and said it's being drawn up, so no drawing at the time of request. He was asked how he came up with the reamed chambers or the special reamer and no response. A friend came to his defense and began singing the praises of his new cartridge but when asked just to take a cellphone photo of the cartridge and post it -- no response.

I guess you can see why there's a lot of skepticism.

He supposedly got a patent for it from what I read. Or maybe it was an application for such

[CPJ 2.0]

You do have a lower center of gravity, recoil affects you less

HA!

[Castle]

He supposedly got a patent for it from what I read. Or maybe it was an application for such

Part of it says,

Richard Gemmrig of Oregon, US Patent No. 11,060,828 - which is limited in scope by the claims to the 17•30’ + 30• shoulder angle when applied to 30 cal bullets being used in 7.62x39mm cartridge cases…

It's public record if you care to look it up. He patented his double shoulder angle design.

[Bigslug]

Lastly, he claimed that the double shoulder design allows for 5 - 8 more grains of powder. Without a drawing, a picture or much in the way of anything else, we can only guess whether or not that's true.

I've been party to maybe half a dozen Ackley Improve jobs. Such is do-able on the .30-06 family. The 7.62x39, while shorter, is a lot more tapered to begin with. Blowing that taper out and the shoulder forward would likely make that possible. Some of the new propellants - such as Leverevolution - can do some impressive things for speed in the right case.

Combining the two to gain 500 fps seems a tad optimistic, but maybe not outside the realm of possibility.

That said, is anyone else dubious about the steel penetration shots - against a plate that stopped standard 7.62x39 cold - being taken with an M80 ball projectile? Seems like steel-core behavior to me.

[CPJ 2.0]

Lastly, he claimed that the double shoulder design allows for 5 - 8 more grains of powder. Without a drawing, a picture or much in the way of anything else, we can only guess whether or not that's true.

I've been party to maybe half a dozen Ackley Improve jobs. Such is do-able on the .30-06 family. The 7.62x39, while shorter, is a lot more tapered to begin with. Blowing that taper out and the shoulder forward would likely make that possible. Some of the new propellants - such as Leverevolution - can do some impressive things for speed in the right case.

Combining the two to gain 500 fps seems a tad optimistic, but maybe not outside the realm of possibility.

That said, is anyone else dubious about the steel penetration shots - against a plate that stopped standard 7.62x39 cold - being taken with an M80 ball projectile? Seems like steel-core behavior to me.

Very dubious. Because it’s my nature. The video reeked of Boomer Fudd marketing.

[breamfisher]

It may be a true "miracle cartridge."

Now y'all gonna get me to watch the video...

[breamfisher]

+500 fps with the same bullet and parent case... NOPE, not without THROUGH THE ROOF pressures. Velocity is based on the time under pressure and the total pressure. The whole "There's no free lunch" principle.

And the curly Q gas tube, how cute.

My understanding on ARs is, that it isn't the length of the gas tube, per se. It's the location of the gas port in relation to the chamber. Closer to the chamber = a more finicky location and further down barrel = one that is normally more forgiving

From what I understand it's port location and port size. The curly gas system probably does lower pressure and increase dwell time a little, but it's probably more because his AR is overpassed and he's trying not to beat the carrier to death when he has it set up to run standard Russian pressures but running the Yahweh rounds through it.

That.... was a really bad video. And the folks on it don't seem to know a lot.


An AR that can hunt elk...

[Bigslug]

Dunno. . .

Making the most apples to apples comparison I can find on Hodgdon's site - CFE Black pushing a 150 grain Hornady out of a 20" barrel 7.62x39 - probably an SKS - they're listing a max charge of 24.5 grains at 2,156 fps and 43,200 CUP (which doesn't really translate to PSI)

On the PSI scale however, we have a lot of .223/5.56 loads operating in the 53,000 to 55,000 psi. Given the overall smaller bore volume of .22 vs. .30 cal, what this guy is claiming for his new wunder-cartridge will be well within the limits of Eugene Stoner's basic mechanism. If I recall correctly, 5.56 pressure in the AR has dropped to something like 20,000 psi at the gas port. Expanding even that same initial 50K chamber pressure into the larger .30 cal bore should make for a gentler cycling gun - given same port size and location.

Still highly dubious of the speeds, but the guy may not be completely full of poop. His video surely doesn't hold up to the Court of the Well-Informed.

[breamfisher]

Depends on who you get the barrel from.

https://tacticalmachining.com/learn/ar- ... sizes.html

[Castle]

...
I've been party to maybe half a dozen Ackley Improve jobs. Such is do-able on the .30-06 family. The 7.62x39, while shorter, is a lot more tapered to begin with. Blowing that taper out and the shoulder forward would likely make that possible. Some of the new propellants - such as Leverevolution - can do some impressive things for speed in the right case.

Combining the two to gain 500 fps seems a tad optimistic, but maybe not outside the realm of possibility.

Unfortunately, we don't even have a picture of the cartridge to know what kind of taper is involved but we do know a little about the powders used.

I'll keep watching that website for any updates.

That said, is anyone else dubious about the steel penetration shots - against a plate that stopped standard 7.62x39 cold - being taken with an M80 ball projectile? Seems like steel-core behavior to me.

He does load that ammo himself so who knows what's going on there. Seems his roll-out is off to a very bumpy start.

[breamfisher]

He said he used 147 gr. bullets.

ASSUMING he's not using. 308 bullets, but rather .311...

There are surplus. 311 bullets that weigh 147 ge.
They're steel cored.

[GrapeApe]

Someone claiming to be "The inventor" of it posted on The high road. He showed up on page 2 of this thread.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?t ... 507/page-2

Pretty funny watching those guys shred him

Edited to add: Here's his introduction.

I’m the inventor of the 7.62 Yahweh cartridge and I named it that because God gave me the idea so out of honor and respect I put his name on it.

It goes downhill for him from there