Guns & Outdoors Forum

sakodude wrote: ↑Sun Nov 03, 2024 6:50 pm Don't think I ever noticed those 400gr Speer before. Might have to try those myself.

They are dead soft too for trapdoor velocities.

Elk Creek wrote: ↑Sun Nov 03, 2024 5:20 pm I was looking at the Speer 400 grain 458 bullet it has 2 canelures
, looks like the front band may be ok for a 45-60…

I will have to dig one out, but I do not believe they have two cannelures anymore. They shot really well out of my little .458 but velocity topped out around 1750 fps compared to the Speer 350gr at 2100 fps.

I was wrong.

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

Any chance you could measure from the top canelure to the flat point for me? I have a few boxes in my cart but I’d like to make sure before I push buy. If it’s too long I’m already pretty much at max OAL for reliable loading with the 350s I’m using.

Wambli Ska wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 4:40 am

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

Any chance you could measure from the top canelure to the flat point for me? I have a few boxes in my cart but I’d like to make sure before I push buy. If it’s too long I’m already pretty much at max OAL for reliable loading with the 350s I’m using.

If it’s a “don’t eat me Mr Bear” gun, I’d take 100% reliability over an extra .22 long rifle-ish weight bullet.

CPJ 2.0 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 4:50 am

Wambli Ska wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 4:40 am

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

Any chance you could measure from the top canelure to the flat point for me? I have a few boxes in my cart but I’d like to make sure before I push buy. If it’s too long I’m already pretty much at max OAL for reliable loading with the 350s I’m using.

If it’s a “don’t eat me Mr Bear” gun, I’d take 100% reliability over an extra .22 long rifle-ish weight bullet.

I absolutely will too and I’m there, but if I can go a hair bigger successfully I’ll try to go for it if nothing else as an experiment to see if it can be done.

Wambli Ska wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 4:40 am

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

Any chance you could measure from the top canelure to the flat point for me? I have a few boxes in my cart but I’d like to make sure before I push buy. If it’s too long I’m already pretty much at max OAL for reliable loading with the 350s I’m using.

Quick measurement has it at 0.454" from flat nose to front of cannelure. Cannelure looks to be around 0.035" wide.

That looks like it could work!

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 10:54 am

Wambli Ska wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 4:40 am

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 04, 2024 8:58 pm I was wrong.

IMG_20241104_155225192_HDR.jpg

Any chance you could measure from the top canelure to the flat point for me? I have a few boxes in my cart but I’d like to make sure before I push buy. If it’s too long I’m already pretty much at max OAL for reliable loading with the 350s I’m using.

Quick measurement has it at 0.454" from flat nose to front of cannelure. Cannelure looks to be around 0.035" wide.

Thanks!!!

Big Al1 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 2:20 pm That looks like it could work!

I think so! I could also cut a set of slightly “short” 45-60 cases just for this purpose. We’re probably talking a few thousands (if even needed) of an inch and since I cut them myself it’s not an issue.

The Speer 400gr was designed with the .45-70 as it's intended use. I would assume the .45-60 is designed to also be able to use the same bullets as the .45-70. I suspect you shouldn't have any issues. I could be wrong again though.

mitdr774 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 05, 2024 5:18 pm The Speer 400gr was designed with the .45-70 as it's intended use. I would assume the .45-60 is designed to also be able to use the same bullets as the .45-70. I suspect you shouldn't have any issues. I could be wrong again though.

The 45-60 came about because Winchester could not lengthen the toggle action of the 1873 anymore than he did to handle the 45-70. The clearance to eject especially a loaded round, is short of a 45/70. But it was the first lever action marketed as a western “dangerous game” rifle. The standard loading was 300gr (or 350?) which was light for a 45-70 but it’s claim to fame was launching a bunch of them into a threat in a big hurry. No small assault on game or BGs.

Now introduce modern steel and heat treating, solid head cases and modern bullets and powders and the 45-60 case is no longer a limitation and the European load standard proof of 28,000 CIP is pretty good for some non-magnum but stout loads. So a small loss of case capacity combined with a bullet that can be seated deep to get closer to 100% fill gives you some interesting possibilities.

Can the rifle handle an overall length of almost 2.35"? I guess that might be one of the deciding factors in being able to use the Speer 400gr.