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Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 1:01 am
by DanielChamberlain
Okay, old eyes starting to piss me off.
No problems at the range, under optimum conditions and slow fire, but starting to notice that the sight picture starts to blur after a few seconds and I have to readjust.
Any one use a dot optic?
Thinking of putting a Mecanik on my Canik. Reviews are good.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 1:40 am
by GrapeApe
I just put a Holosun 407 on my Dagger this week.
One range trip to get it sighted in, and I'm liking it so far
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 2:17 pm
by Bigslug
Running Holosun 509T and EPS Carry.
I had started with the 507 series but found the open-backed sights to be lint and dirt traps with the potential to present you with a really crappy sight picture at inopportune times and are a real PITA to keep clean.
Enclosed emitter sights: just drag a corner of your T-shirt across the back of them from time to time.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 4:48 pm
by Zee
Bigslug wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2023 2:17 pm
Running Holosun 509T and EPS Carry.
I had started with the 507 series but found the open-backed sights to be lint and dirt traps with the potential to present you with a really crappy sight picture at inopportune times and are a real PITA to keep clean.
Enclosed emitter sights: just drag a corner of your T-shirt across the back of them from time to time.
I prefer closed emitters as well.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 5:47 pm
by Wambli Ska
Holosun EPS Carry on my Glock 48 MOS. I prefer closed emitters too.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 7:40 pm
by Bigslug
A little more response to the "old eyes" issues of your OP.
Progressive lenses weren't really getting it done for me. The upper, distance prescription was OK, but the narrowing taper of the lower progressive field and its lack of peripheral range was a puzzle I couldn't decently crack - or at least didn't want to continue spending time and money to crack. As such, I'm in traditional bifocals with the lower section being set for where the front iron sight of a pistol ends up. Fortunately, this same prescription works well enough for reading and working on guns, but the "bifocal head tilt" to get a clear front sight ain't exactly realistic, tactically speaking. I use the bifocals for deliberate, slow-fire checking of pistol sights, but for running irons quickly, or with rifles, there's no choice but to use the distance prescription and align the blurs as best I can.
The success of that depends a great deal on available lighting. In real, actual daylight, I can run irons almost as well as I ever could. In the less-than-optimal lighting of most indoor ranges, I can fudge it well enough for combat purposes; with a weapon-mounted or other flashlight illuminating my target and backlighting my iron sights, about the same; on a night shoot with tritium sights and no flashlight, it's a complete train wreck.
With carbines, a peephole rear sight helps focus the front sight, but mounting the front sight farther out either on a longer barrel or almost-to-muzzle-tubular AR handguard is a real improvement.
I mainly bring these things up as possible yardsticks by which to measure how messed up and fossilized our old eyes are, and how to judge the advantage for you of dots over irons. The simple reality is that having the thing you aim with exist in the same focal plane as your target solves a lot of visual problems even for young people whose eyes still work; for those of us over 45 who are being kicked daily in the balls by presbyopia, dots are the crutch that let us continue to exist on a level playing field with the 20-somethings - - which, when you stop to think about it, is most of the predators you might have to deploy against.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2023 12:30 am
by Rugerfan
When I had my first pair of progressive lens with vision insurance, they required their lab to ground them. Before the optometrist did in his lab. That pair from the ins drove me crazy at first. The area that was ground was very narrow.
The next pair I paid extra to have a wider area ground. I like that better. You may want to see if that’s an option for you.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2023 2:16 am
by shotgunshooter3
Been carrying a Glock 19 with RMR attached by direct milling for about five years now. Love it.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2023 9:17 pm
by Japhy
Bigslug wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2023 7:40 pm
A little more response to the "old eyes" issues of your OP.
Progressive lenses weren't really getting it done for me. The upper, distance prescription was OK, but the narrowing taper of the lower progressive field and its lack of peripheral range was a puzzle I couldn't decently crack - or at least didn't want to continue spending time and money to crack. As such, I'm in traditional bifocals with the lower section being set for where the front iron sight of a pistol ends up. Fortunately, this same prescription works well enough for reading and working on guns, but the "bifocal head tilt" to get a clear front sight ain't exactly realistic, tactically speaking. I use the bifocals for deliberate, slow-fire checking of pistol sights, but for running irons quickly, or with rifles, there's no choice but to use the distance prescription and align the blurs as best I can.
The success of that depends a great deal on available lighting. In real, actual daylight, I can run irons almost as well as I ever could. In the less-than-optimal lighting of most indoor ranges, I can fudge it well enough for combat purposes; with a weapon-mounted or other flashlight illuminating my target and backlighting my iron sights, about the same; on a night shoot with tritium sights and no flashlight, it's a complete train wreck.
With carbines, a peephole rear sight helps focus the front sight, but mounting the front sight farther out either on a longer barrel or almost-to-muzzle-tubular AR handguard is a real improvement.
I mainly bring these things up as possible yardsticks by which to measure how messed up and fossilized our old eyes are, and how to judge the advantage for you of dots over irons. The simple reality is that having the thing you aim with exist in the same focal plane as your target solves a lot of visual problems even for young people whose eyes still work; for those of us over 45 who are being kicked daily in the balls by presbyopia, dots are the crutch that let us continue to exist on a level playing field with the 20-somethings - - which, when you stop to think about it, is most of the predators you might have to deploy against.
Glasses these days! Can’t see with ‘em, can’t see without ‘em!
I bought new glasses recently prescription was nearly identical but the frames were in bad shape.
as an experiment with progressive lens I removed my shooting side lens from the frame then inverted it on the rear of the 1911. This brought the front sight into tack sharp focus though the target was blurred. The rear sight was shaper than it was but not perfect. I’m really tempted to order a pair of discount glasses with the right lens inverted. I’m left eye dominant so I should be able to see well and shoot better?
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2023 12:17 am
by Diver43
Japhy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 9:17 pm
Bigslug wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2023 7:40 pm
A little more response to the "old eyes" issues of your OP.
Progressive lenses weren't really getting it done for me. The upper, distance prescription was OK, but the narrowing taper of the lower progressive field and its lack of peripheral range was a puzzle I couldn't decently crack - or at least didn't want to continue spending time and money to crack. As such, I'm in traditional bifocals with the lower section being set for where the front iron sight of a pistol ends up. Fortunately, this same prescription works well enough for reading and working on guns, but the "bifocal head tilt" to get a clear front sight ain't exactly realistic, tactically speaking. I use the bifocals for deliberate, slow-fire checking of pistol sights, but for running irons quickly, or with rifles, there's no choice but to use the distance prescription and align the blurs as best I can.
The success of that depends a great deal on available lighting. In real, actual daylight, I can run irons almost as well as I ever could. In the less-than-optimal lighting of most indoor ranges, I can fudge it well enough for combat purposes; with a weapon-mounted or other flashlight illuminating my target and backlighting my iron sights, about the same; on a night shoot with tritium sights and no flashlight, it's a complete train wreck.
With carbines, a peephole rear sight helps focus the front sight, but mounting the front sight farther out either on a longer barrel or almost-to-muzzle-tubular AR handguard is a real improvement.
I mainly bring these things up as possible yardsticks by which to measure how messed up and fossilized our old eyes are, and how to judge the advantage for you of dots over irons. The simple reality is that having the thing you aim with exist in the same focal plane as your target solves a lot of visual problems even for young people whose eyes still work; for those of us over 45 who are being kicked daily in the balls by presbyopia, dots are the crutch that let us continue to exist on a level playing field with the 20-somethings - - which, when you stop to think about it, is most of the predators you might have to deploy against.
Glasses these days! Can’t see with ‘em, can’t see without ‘em!
I bought new glasses recently prescription was nearly identical but the frames were in bad shape.
as an experiment with progressive lens I removed my shooting side lens from the frame then inverted it on the rear of the 1911. This brought the front sight into tack sharp focus though the target was blurred. The rear sight was shaper than it was but not perfect. I’m really tempted to order a pair of discount glasses with the right lens inverted. I’m left eye dominant so I should be able to see well and shoot better?
Tell your eye doc that you are a shooter. Your progressive lenses can be cut so that you can aim a handgun with them.
My eye doc down south was a air force eye doc for the pilots at Homestead ARB. He explained it is possible to adjust lenses for shooting a handgun but much more complex for a rifle maybe your Rx can be adjusted
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2023 1:18 am
by Gila
I'm far sighted and wear trifocals so I can see very fine detail when I need to. So I had my optometrist write me a second prescription especially for shooting for my dominate eye. With it, everything becomes somewhat blurred at distance, but I can see my front sights perfectly on all of my weapons, or I can tilt my head to see clearly at distance with a bifocal lens if I need to with my dominate eye. I have my normal lens in the other half of these glasses.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2023 1:23 am
by Japhy
Diver that’s a good suggestion. I shoot long guns left left eye is dominant and no astigmatism. I’m simi ambidextrous but left handed pistol trigger control is something I have not been able to get working
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Sat Nov 18, 2023 5:08 pm
by DanielChamberlain
I'm still capable of placing the first round in the head at 15 yards double action semi-auto fairly quickly. But I know a dot would make precision easier. In my case, I can see the target perfectly but the front sight is blurred. With readers, the front sight is sharp and the target is slightly blurred. Gonna try the dot for a while and see what happens.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2023 1:51 pm
by Bigslug
Started trying a new pair of progressive glasses out this week. Had them make the variable part of the field as wide as possible. Definitely missing the greater peripheral vision the traditional bifocals offer, but the ability to determine your own compromise of how blurry the sight and target are is helpful.
My ophthalmologist - who's also a middle-aged shooter - summed it up with these two points a couple years ago:
1. Old eyes hurt.
2. Presbyopia sucks.
Needless to say, hearing this bit of optimism from a medical expert with over 8 years of schoolin' did wonders for my usually cheerful outlook.
But the real point is that a red dot on your daily carry pieces saves you from the dial-a-focal-plane challenges that you aren't going to have time to deal with. The grudging acceptance I've come to is that modern optical tech can give us glasses that will still let us play with the old historical pieces we enjoy. . .kinda. . .somewhat. . .in decent light, while a red dot equipped pistol is a practical, knock-around tool that levels the playing field with the 40-and-unders who's eye-interiors are still squishy.
I still don't 100% trust the durability of the sights and mounting systems, but they're to the point I can trust them enough - and no doubt it'll eventually get there.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2023 7:05 pm
by GrapeApe
Slug, when you do, if they're "legal" in commiefornia, I STRONGLY recommend the PSA Dagger.
It's a Gen 3 Glock with a decent grip.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 4:25 am
by Bigslug
GrapeApe wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2023 7:05 pm
Slug, when you do, if they're "legal" in commiefornia, I STRONGLY recommend the PSA Dagger.
It's a Gen 3 Glock with a decent grip.
Which to me would mean they just ground off the finger grooves and called it a day. . .
Moot point - we'll never see them here in quantity until we make the state roster go away.
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:46 pm
by GrapeApe
Took off the finger grooves, reshaped it a little and put a good texture on it
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2023 9:23 pm
by Japhy
I am considering getting a shooting prescription that changes the progressive taper in my glasses.
I did an experiment over the past several days dryfiring the 1911 with the laser bullet. The 1911 has irons, adjustable rear sight and fiber front.
First session about 11am outside full sun. Front sight was reasonably sharp target at 10yds.
Next distance prescription polarized sunglasses front sight is well lit but far less sharp than without the sunglasses
Next at dusk in low light out of direct sun same setup. Front sight was definitely fuzzy.
Next after dark with target lighted terrible!
My conclusion is that in low light or darkness even with the fiber front sight the depth of field due to pupils being dilated is a problem. A dot might cover each of those cases well?
Re: Optic On Carry Piece
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2023 4:45 am
by Bigslug
Japhy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 12, 2023 9:23 pm
I am considering getting a shooting prescription that changes the progressive taper in my glasses.
I did an experiment over the past several days dryfiring the 1911 with the laser bullet. The 1911 has irons, adjustable rear sight and fiber front.
First session about 11am outside full sun. Front sight was reasonably sharp target at 10yds.
Next distance prescription polarized sunglasses front sight is well lit but far less sharp than without the sunglasses
Next at dusk in low light out of direct sun same setup. Front sight was definitely fuzzy.
Next after dark with target lighted terrible!
My conclusion is that in low light or darkness even with the fiber front sight the depth of field due to pupils being dilated is a problem. A dot might cover each of those cases well?
The smaller your pupils are contracted, generally the sharper you can focus. When you combine the middle age "eye death" of presbyopia (loss of ability to shift focal distances) with the pupil dilation caused by low light, you find yourself frequently cursing the light level in any room you're trying to do fine tasks in.
Your dot will generally be clearly focused within your distance prescription. Yes, ambient light conditions will alter that somewhat, but your worst case is that you'll probably have a reasonably well-defined dot that only covers 2 to 4 MOA, so even if it's a little blurry, it's still a sharper aiming device than a blurry 10-20 MOA front sight blade.
Fiber optic or other brightly colored front sights may or may not be problematic. I don't like to shoot them through my distance prescription since their fluorescence causes them to "halo" until I roll up into my progressives or bifocals. I run solid black backup sights with my red dots on the notion that if the dot is dead, I'll be backlighting my irons with a weapon-mounted light. I can tell where the top edge of a blurry black iron sight is better than a neon green or red one. YMMV.